Team Addiscombe

[Jon H]

[quote="Keith"]Opinions please.

[quote="-Adam-"][quote="Sylv"]Is Paul dissing the idea just because Adam approves of it

[quote="Sylv"][quote="-Adam-"][quote="Sylv"]Is Paul dissing the idea just because Adam approves of it

[Andy E]

I'd be well up for this (although I can't make this Saturday as it's my recovery week).. Whether it's doing a recce of courses or simply by doing the club run without the cafe stop (i know that's heresey to some ). Personally i find all the stopping and starting on Saturdays a bit frustrating at this time of year and would much prefer a non-stop ride of 3hrs or so, perhaps with a cafe stop at the end.

I also agree with us trying to practice race situations on these outings. Things like trying to control the bunch if one of our riders has made the break, organising chases if we haven't, lead-outs etc. I'm not sure what the best way to do this is, and would probably have to defer to the more experienced among us. Although i'm really keen to race this year, simply turning up and riding as a bunch of individuals doesn't really excite me, whereas turning up to a race with even a rough plan and some idea of how to execute tactics in different scenarios sounds like a lot more fun to me. Plus it should bring about better results for the club, which is surely what we all want?

It's a long old race season so any of this stuff we can do over the next few months will hopefully still reap benefits this season.

[Michelle]

Now now gentlemen, each to their own training schedule. If it does not suit Paul to train in this way at the minute, then he won't be training with this group.

We all know the new stuff is very suck-it-and-see in any case (fnarr fnarr) so just play it by ear.

It sounds like a much better way to bring on riders in the club in any case. I may even be able to suck a wheel or two (easy finbarr)

[Mulberry]

View from the sidelines:
I tend to agree with Keith and would echo Adam’s points especially as this proposal is what all other clubs / teams do if they are serious about training and progressing their riders.

I think the TG currently offers benefit to two people at least – George & Paul – although it could probably provide them with more still. Paul seems to be missing the point here as Keith’s suggestion was to improve the training group and make it more accessible. It is currently impenetrable to most people below 2nd cat standard.

If George and Paul find the initial first hour is too easy, then simply deposit them 5+ minutes behind the rest of the group and make them chase to overcome the handicap. By the time they catch up, they will be more tired and the rest of you will be ready to go faster with them anyway. Likewise as Adam said by riding smoothly T&O or better still doing long hard turns on the front, then weaker riders can still keep up and do a turn occasionally, thus training and learning to ride in a tight group.

Paul - I agree that marathon runners don’t train beyond their race distance but what on earth have marathons got to do with the cut and thrust of road racing. Also why do track riders do 3-5 hrs (of endurance and tempo) when their races last just minutes? I know you have a sort of chaingang, but this plan provides a safe environment in daylight without much traffic which more people can probably get too. Plus you won’t have to stop almost every 5 mins for traffic lights.

One key point of Keith’s is the plan to ride disciplined and as a team on different routes as there is so much more to RRs then just going hard. The ability to ride smartly and safely should not be under-estimated and can literally save lives!

Alternatively you can ignore all of these suggestions and continue with the same TG in the same format, on the same route dropping the same people on the same day every week for the next 12 months. I’m not bothered ; - )

Marcus

Keith asked for opinions.

[quote]Is Paul dissing the idea just because Adam approves of it

[kieran]

Well, must admit I personally don't like the current saturday morning club run set up for training and time management purposes. For the last few Saturdays I have left home late and cycled straight to the cafe non-stop via the DC (40miles - so approx 2 hours), do a toilet stop, refuel and then head home either by myself or I sometimes join the club (as I usually arrive when everyone else is leaving), so no waiting around either at CSS or the Cafe (or at box hill when on my own). So I get a good training ride in, I can leave home later and get home sooner!

E.g this saturday I left Crystal Palace at 9:15, passed CSS 42 min later and arrived at the Cafe 2hours 1min later, having averaged over 21mph from CSS to the Cafe. Grabbed 2 bananas and 2 drinks and headed home via the short route with 2 others and home just after 1pm. 4 hours of mainly riding, about 5mins wasted.
I do my chatting here on the forum, A bit sad (?) but this suits me though as I'm a bit of an introvert anyway!

[quote="Paul H"]Keith asked for opinions.

[quote]Is Paul dissing the idea just because Adam approves of it

[Mulberry]

I suspect that ACC is quite unique in the UK in being so big with just one official ride and if you look at the way other clubs operate in the UK I would be amazed if you could find another that follows this pattern. Whilst its nice to be unique you will find that the "common" set up with official rides on Sat & Sun plus organised chaingangs / training sessions helps cater for mixed abilities and provides scope for rapid progression if people so desire.

[quote]The TG is not neccessarily the safest group, the more disciplined 18-20s are probably the safest, especially as they aren't trying to rip each others legs off, getting tired, and riding all over the road annoying car drivers.

[Paul H]

[quote]The TG is not accessible, because people dont like to take the plunge then get dropped before they evern reach the M23 turning. I've said it before and I'll say it again, that the way in which the TG operates is incredibly stupid. If you are training, why do you all just try to drop each other for an hour?

[Jon H]

[img]http://www.cargurus.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2009/02/can-of-worms.jpg[/img]

[George]

I remember when I first started improving and doing the faster groups, quite often I would get dropped and just ride home alone disheartened, this is one of the key reasons I got stronger as a rider, as I hated getting dropped and being the odd one out.

You've got to make some mistakes to learn and improve as a rider or team, and riding above your league only helps although it is quite painful and not for the faint hearted.

Adam you say the TG is not the safest group how would you know your never in it

Fitness and strength are the main reasons to go hard in the training group, tactics and technique will only come with conversation and race experience.

I'm doing 3 chaingangs this week who's joining me then?

[Dominic]

I'll be joining you tomorrow

[Keith]

[quote="Paul H"]I can see im not going to win this argument so I guess its the TT bike for me on Saturday.